POCETNICKA PITANJA

Sve vezano za ovaj tabletop wargame.

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bojan
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by bojan »

Za ljubitelje modela koji cuce:
Ako neko ne vidi model, onda ni taj model ne vidi nista.
Ne moze i jare i pare.
CYNIC, n.
A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

deka wrote:Da li je moguće u Cadian temed Imperial Guard armiji koristiti Komesara Gaunta i njegove duhove (ili samo njega)?
A zasto ne bi? Ako u knjizi ne postoji pravilo u kojoj pise da Gaunta ne mozes da koristis ako svoje modele ofarbas kao kadijance, onda ne mozes. A kako sam sto posto siguran da to ne pise, znaci da mozes.
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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opsidiannight
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by opsidiannight »

A sto se toliko tripujete oko visine modela. Licno bih voleo da vidi Shaferove momke kako puze, eldarskog farseera koji lebdi, marinacke Jump Packere 10 cm u vazduhu. Mislim da ce problem pre biti to sto ce ljudi modelovati svoje figure da budu sto vise, pogotovo shooti modele, nego sto ce ih kovertovati da budu niski. Evo ja cu svod Defilera napraviti da se propinje, instant bolji line of sight. :wink:
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by bojan »

Hypodermic wrote:
deka wrote:...A zasto ne bi?...
Zato sto recimo Ursakar Creed-a i Jarann Kell-a mozes koristiti samo u vojsci koja koristi Cadia-nske doktrine.
Nema to veze sa farbanjem vec sa doktrinama.
CYNIC, n.
A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
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deka
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by deka »

bojan wrote: ...Ursakar Creed-a i Jarann Kell-a...
Pa to kapiram pošto su oni Cadian's Special karakteri (Creed je Lord Castelan... i tako to, a Kell mu je zastavnik). Oni mu dođu kao Lord Calgar i Tugurius Ultramarincima...

Mene bune pomenuti komesar pukovnik Gaunt, njegovi duhovi i komesar Yarick, pošto Gaunt i duhovi više nemaju planetu (Tainth? je uništen ili zagađen haos-om), pa su prinuđeni da se "muvaju okolo", a za Yarick-a uopšte nisam našao odakle je.

Tako da nisam bio siguran da li mogu da ih koristim u mojoj (budućoj) Cadia- themed armijici Imperijalnih gardista...

Dakle, pošto ste rekli da Gaunta i njegove duhove mogu da koristim, kako se treturaju? (Gaunt je verovatno neko HQ, a duhovi su troop ili šta?)...

Takođe što se da zaključiti iz gornjeg izlaganja da li i komesar Yarick može biti upotrebljen sa Cadia-ncima???

Šta ću kada volim spec. karaktere, tj. figure koje ih predstavljaju :oops: :oops: :oops:
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by mladjano bugarce »

Da mogu i to svi sp. karakteri. Ono sto je znaimljivo je da NE MOZES koristiti u regularnim partijama REGIMENTU TANITH FIRST AND ONLY zato sto imaju previse doktrina.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by bojan »

mladjano bugarce wrote:...Ono sto je znaimljivo je da NE MOZES koristiti u regularnim partijama REGIMENTU TANITH FIRST AND ONLY zato sto imaju previse doktrina.
Bojane, zapravo mozes - pogledaj gardijski FAQ - Tanith, Cadia i josh neko (Valhalla) imaju 6-7 doktrina i GW-ov odgovor je - da ako koristis bas te doktrine sa bas tim modelima - moze, jer oni su baje pa im se moze.
CYNIC, n.
A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
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meloras
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by meloras »

EDIT: U IG armiji da li se heavy waepon timovi krecu odvojeno ili zajedno za jedinicom (infantry squad)?Da li isto vazi i za support squadove iz command squada?
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by zliki »

hevi vepon timovi idu zajedno sa jedinicom u kojoj su , napr.iron fist jedinica sa himerom a jedinice sacinjene od samo hv timova idu odvojeno.valjda :?:
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Komsija Edward
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Komsija Edward »

Unapred se izvinjavam ako ponavljam pitanje ali stigao sam do 4 strane i nisam imao vise snage da citam.
Da li se figure kupuju kroz random boostere ( kao npr. D&D Miniatures ) ili moze da se bas bira sta bih kupio?
I Jel igra neko to jos uvek ? Cisto da znam da li cu imati sa kim da se prepucavam ako se ukljucim u sve to.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

....jesam malo pripit, ali ja nemam pojma o cemu ti pricas. Jel se jos uvek igra sta? (ovo je 40k pod-forum, tako da ako je u pitanju D&D, pitao si na pogresnom mestu)
Mind Uploader wrote:... Kazem ja da je Pera isti Darth Vader, samo bez te moralne dubine...
Hypodermic wrote:Da nije robotech-a ne bih bio ovakakv kakav jesam!
Giga wrote:Realno, sasvim je logicno da mogu bez problema da ih bace sa par stotina metara i da budu prilicno sigurni da tom land raideru nece biti nista
igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Pendargon »

napred se izvinjavam ako ponavljam pitanje ali stigao sam do 4 strane i nisam imao vise snage da citam.
Da li se figure kupuju kroz random boostere ( kao npr. D&D Miniatures ) ili moze da se bas bira sta bih kupio?
I Jel igra neko to jos uvek ? Cisto da znam da li cu imati sa kim da se prepucavam ako se ukljucim u sve to.
40k NIJE collectible game. Ovde UVEK znas sta si kupio, kupujes bas to sa nekom namerom, i gradis vojsku onakvu kakvu ti zelis (za razliku od D&D minijatura). 40k, uz warmachine, trenutno ima verovatno najsiru populaciju igraca kod nas (u stvari, verovatno se najredovnije igra), tako da ces uvek imati partnere za rat (sto se vidi po broju tema na ovom podforumu...)
Neces pogresiti ako odlucis da se upustis u 40k.
Pozdrav.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Komsija edvarde... mislim da si ili omasio topik ili si se nesto gadno istripovao....
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Uf, ovo kacim prvenstveno radi sebe, jer ZergLord ima gadnu naviku da koristi doticne fraze :) Takodje, molim istog da dpuni spisak :D

Tiranidska terminologija:
-Dakkafex AKA Sladoledzija - Carnifex sa 2 tl devoeura
-Dakkarant AKA Leteci Sladoledzija - Winged Tyrant sa 2 tl devoeura (do sada nisam vidoe ovo bez krila)
-FLyrant - jako losa kovanica za winged tyranta
-Boomfex - Barbed strangler i ST carni
-Gunfex - BS i VC Carni (all shooty sto bi se reklo)
-BocaBuba - Carnifex sa SVIM mogucim biomorphovima na sebi, najcesce 250+ poena.
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

-Dakkarant AKA Leteci Sladoledzija - Winged Tyrant sa 2 tl devoeura (do sada nisam vidoe ovo bez krila)
Zerglord je izveo to cudo bez krila protiv mene, imao je i Tyrant Guardu....jedini ostao na tabli....bez garde :D
-BocaBuba - Carnifex sa SVIM mogucim biomorphovima na sebi, najcesce 250+ poena.
Na GWovom sajtu poznat kao Death Beetle :)

Za necrone ne treba terminologija, osim sledecih pojmova:

-Korisno: Immortals, Destroyer Lord, Monolith, Destroyers, Wraiths
-Beskorisno: Pariahs, Flayed Ones, Tomb Spyders, Heavy Destroyers
-Za ambiciozne: Veil Lord, Scarab Swarms
-Za zajebanciju: Deceiver, Nightbringer
-Ono sto moras, a voleo bi da mozes bez: Warriors
-Ono sto moras, a i zelis,bogami: resurrection orb
-Ono cega se najvise bojis: Phase-out
-Daj caci dinju!: jurenje setica za Gauss effect na vozilo :)
-Necron laundry : charge,teleport,reroll WBB,charge,teleport,reroll WBB (rinse,repeat)
-Wraith assault : ako se dobro postavis, assault u prvom krugu uz pomoc monolitha :)
-Protivnikove sede vlasi : living metal kod monolitha, i WBB :)

To je sve :lol: :lol:
Mind Uploader wrote:... Kazem ja da je Pera isti Darth Vader, samo bez te moralne dubine...
Hypodermic wrote:Da nije robotech-a ne bih bio ovakakv kakav jesam!
Giga wrote:Realno, sasvim je logicno da mogu bez problema da ih bace sa par stotina metara i da budu prilicno sigurni da tom land raideru nece biti nista
igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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ZergLord
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by ZergLord »

Hypodermic wrote:Uf, ovo kacim prvenstveno radi sebe, jer ZergLord ima gadnu naviku da koristi doticne fraze :) Takodje, molim istog da dpuni spisak :D

Tiranidska terminologija:
-Dakkafex AKA Sladoledzija - Carnifex sa 2 tl devoeura
-Dakkarant AKA Leteci Sladoledzija - Winged Tyrant sa 2 tl devoeura (do sada nisam vidoe ovo bez krila)
-FLyrant - jako losa kovanica za winged tyranta
-Boomfex - Barbed strangler i ST carni
-Gunfex - BS i VC Carni (all shooty sto bi se reklo)
-BocaBuba - Carnifex sa SVIM mogucim biomorphovima na sebi, najcesce 250+ poena.
Deviltyrant - isto kao Dakkatyrant
Devilfex - isto kao Dakkafex (inace, preferiram te termine jer Dakkafex\tyrant zvuci orkovski, sto je neprikladno)
Devilgaunt: Gant sa Devourerom, i obicno ima Toxin Sacs (+Str)
Walkrant - obicni Tyrant bez krila
Godfex - kao BocaBuba samo sto ne mora da ima SVE MOGUCE biomorfe :)
Ninjafex - carni sa 2x Scything Talons, Adrenal glands (WS, I) i jos nekim biomorfom po izboru
Sniperfex - carni sa Barbed stranglerom i Venom Cannonom
Babyfex - bilo kakav fex elitni fex (znaci da kosta ispod 115 poena)
Venomgaunt - Hormagant sa Toxin sacs (+Str) i Adrenal glands (I)
Hypergaunt - Hormagant sa Adrenal glands (I, WS)
Ubergaunt - Hormagant sa Adrenal glands (I, WS) i Toxin Sacs (+Str)

+BS: Ballistic Skill upgrade (Enhanced Senses)
+WS: Weapon Skill upgrade (Adrenal Glands)
+Str: Strength upgrade (Toxin Sacs)
+A: Attack upgrade (Scything Talons)
+T: Toughness upgrade (Bonded Exoskeleton)
+W: Wound upgrade (Reinforced Chitin)
+I: Initiative upgrade (Adrenal Glands)
+SV: Armour save upgrade (Extended Carapace)

To bi bilo to. :P
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

O gospode, znaci da je moj CC carni u stvari babyninjafex :D
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by bojan »

Saethwyr wrote:...
-Wraith assault : ako se dobro postavis, assault u prvom krugu uz pomoc monolitha :)
No longer.
CYNIC, n.
A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be. Hence the custom among the Scythians of plucking out a cynic's eyes to improve his vision.
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ZergLord
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by ZergLord »

Hypodermic wrote:O gospode, znaci da je moj CC carni u stvari babyninjafex :D
Ne, on je samo Ninjafex. :)
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PeraNekron
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

No longer.
Mozda ce moci sa onim deploymentom od 18'' od protivnika.
Mind Uploader wrote:... Kazem ja da je Pera isti Darth Vader, samo bez te moralne dubine...
Hypodermic wrote:Da nije robotech-a ne bih bio ovakakv kakav jesam!
Giga wrote:Realno, sasvim je logicno da mogu bez problema da ih bace sa par stotina metara i da budu prilicno sigurni da tom land raideru nece biti nista
igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Ja bih samo imortale prebacio iz "korisno" u "za ambiciozne", a scarab swarm vice versa...
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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PeraNekron
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

Pricas iz svog golemog iskustva? :roll:
Mind Uploader wrote:... Kazem ja da je Pera isti Darth Vader, samo bez te moralne dubine...
Hypodermic wrote:Da nije robotech-a ne bih bio ovakakv kakav jesam!
Giga wrote:Realno, sasvim je logicno da mogu bez problema da ih bace sa par stotina metara i da budu prilicno sigurni da tom land raideru nece biti nista
igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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Dzon Vejn
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Nisam video ovaj komentar ranije, a odgovor je: "Da".

A sad da postavim svoje pitanje:

Interesuje me kako se u HS igraju nova LoS pravila?
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
Hypodermic
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Iz mog iskustva protiv nekrona:
Immortali - 5+ svaka cast momci, ovo bih i ja imao u svojoj armiji
Skarabi - 2+, ok mozes da glanceujes vozilo na 6 ali gines od mrkog pogleda gaunta... a to nije za pohvalu.

A sto se LoS-a tice, igra se kako treba da se igra - onako kako i pise u knjizi. Kako ce od nedelje biti i dovoljno brda koja su dovoljno visoka da sakriju i Land raider, ne vidim potrebu da se igra drugacije.
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Dzon Vejn
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Hypodermic wrote: A sto se LoS-a tice, igra se kako treba da se igra - onako kako i pise u knjizi. Kako ce od nedelje biti i dovoljno brda koja su dovoljno visoka da sakriju i Land raider, ne vidim potrebu da se igra drugacije.
Hvala na odgovoru... pitao sam iz dva razloga:

1. Recimo GW-ova brda (dakle ona koja su ONI napravili) su beskorisna za 40k... naravno ima tu jos terena, ali ovo je bas specificno.... zapravo, vecina GW terena koje imam sada postaje mnogo manje korisna. No dobro, ajde ovo cu i da se prilagodim nekako ali:

2. Cini mi se da je LoS pravilo najubogije pravilo ikada izaslo iz GWa (a ja igram GW igre JAKO dugo).... mozda bih preterao ako bih rekao da je to najubogije pravilo u bilo kojoj igri (ipak postoje i igre kao recimo bas-celik), ali svakako nije ni daleko od toga.

Za sada mi se ostatak pravila cini sasvim ok (nisam jos sve prelistao). Malo ima 1 sitnija rupa oko dodeljivanja woundova (dva identicna modela popiju 4 wounda, ti spases 1, i onda se onaj 1 wound discarduje jer ostali modeli u unitu nisu identicni), ali dobro, ovo je pravilo i dalje bolje od predhodnih pravila za dodeljivanje woundova.

Voleo bih bas da cujem i misljenja ljudi koji igraju u kucnoj varijanti na one dve stvari koje sam naveo gore?
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
Hypodermic
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Igrali sa gw-ovim brdima danas. POtpuno upotrebljiva za davanje cover save-a. Iovako treba navici ljude da su ta brda mala :) Plus, ima i ono gw brdo koje ima 2 nivoa, ono je vec ok. Dalje, GW zgrade su odlicne za 40k, jer ove nove zgrade mogu da sakriju svasta.

Ma koliko je TLoS pravilo nezgodno (i mozda cak i ubogo), rad sam pre da probam da igram sa takvim pravilom nekoliko meseci pa tek onda da vidim da li mogu da smislim nesto bolje a sto ne kvari balans vise nego postojece pravilo (posto svi znamo da igra nije izbalansirana, nekako ako menjam pravila zelim da je zadrzim na istoj (ne)izbalansiranosti :D).

A sto se tvog primera tice, jako los primer. Ni u kom momentu ne postoji rana koja ce jednostavno "nestati", ako 2 modela popiju 4 rane (po 2) i ti lepo spasis obe rane od jednog modela, odlicno, taj ti je ziv. Ne dodeljuju se rane "per unit type" vec "per model per unit type" Drugim recima ako je tvoja jedinica od 10 marinaca popila 23 rane recimo, savrseno je moguce da ce jedan od njih kome si dodelio 3 rane da prodje sve 3, dok ce neki drugi da padne oba sejva (i da umre, popivsi mnogo vise paljbe nego sto je trebalo).
Ima jako lep primer u knjizi gde su nacrtali kako marine igrac dodeljuje rane svojim modelima. Takodje ima i primer da ako je tvoj squad od 10 modela popio 11 rana, od cega su 2 od plazme, ti imas puno pravo da obe stavis na jednog modela, i efektivno "izmenadzerises" svoje gubitke.
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Gresis Boco, strana 25, pogledaj dijagram i tekst u njemu:
He goes to roll the 4 saves for the space marines with bolters (2 komada) in 1 go, failing 2. He should remove 3 models (2 unsaved wounds plus 1 with no armor save from the meltagun), but as there are only 2 models in this group of identical models, he just removes them both.
edit: plus se ne baca kako kazes, nego za svaki TIP modela sumirano (znaci ne bacas za model po model, nego za grupu modela zajedno).
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Ok, pise gore iznad diagrama prolaze po batch-ovima... a taman se ponadao da su nesto u vezi pucanja uradili kako treba pa ne moze da te umre mnogo :) ipak, i dalje stoji da mozes da usmrtis jednog marinca od 2 plazme, jer mozes obe da dodelis na njega ako je bilo dovoljno rana u salvi (a jedna salva je sva paljba od jednog unita).
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

To moze, ali nije bas da ce ti se preterano cesto desavati takva situacija (s obzirom na to da ce uniti sada biti veci jer su jedino oni scoring).

Malo je lose i to sto biras na koga ide plazma ali dobro, generalno pravila oko pucanja i close combata su dosta poboljsana.

I samo jos mala napomena: ista pravila se koriste i u close combatu, osim sto se odradi prvo inicijativa 10, pa bace svi save-ovi, pa inicijativa 9, pa opet svi saveovi, itd. Woundovi se rasporedjuju kao kod pucanja. Strana 39 za one koji ne veruju.

edit: i jos jedna napomena: vodite racuna da power fist, light. claw i thunder hammer u kombinaciji sa CC weapon sada NEMAJU bonus napad (light. claw nije ni pre). Skinuo sam army builder verziju od pre 3 dana i u njoj to nije popravljeno. Strana 42, a normal and special weapon, paragraf 2.
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

1.
Ajmo jos par pitanja kako se igra u HS:

p108, victory points:
This may also be useful in tournaments, where the
organisers need a better spread of results among the
players, so some finer degrees of victory may be useful.
To cover these situations, players may agree to calculate
victory points (VPs). VPs are gained by inflicting damage
on enemy units, as follows.
Kako se igraju seize ground & capture and control misije?

2.
p90
STANDARD MISSIONS CHART
D6 Mission
1-2 Seize Ground
3-4 Capture and Control
5-6 Annihilation

I onda posle nema opis za annihilation.... kako se igra isti?

3.
Pise u pravilima da samo scouring trupe contestuju objective, ali da bilo koja trupa moze da ponisti. Nista ne pise o "scoring" as in prosloj ediciji (da moras da budes preko pola). Neki info vezan za ovo?

4.
Ako se igraju VP na turnirima (kao i pre), kako se racunaju objektivi? Ok za Seize ground predpostavljam 1500 poena (ili koliko vec se igra) / sa brojem objektiva vredi svaki objektiv. Sta je sa Capture and Controll, sa obzirom da tu ima samo 2 objektiva?
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Kako smo za sada samo dve partije odigrali po petoj, mogu samo da nagadjam za VP. Ono sto je definitivno je da ce se VP racunati na turnirima zarad eliminacije draw rezultata (sem ako opet razlika ne bude manja od 10% kao u staroj ediciji).
Po novoj ediciji postoje samo tri rezultata: win, draw, i loose. U slucaju objektiva, dobija onaj ko ima vise, u slucaju anihilate misije dobija onaj ko je ostvario vise kill poena. E sad, u .pdf verziji kill poeni nisu objasnjeni verovatno zato sto ej ta strana nekako porgutana or something. Isti rade (99%, bicemo 100% sigurni kada budemo drzali knjigu u rukama) na sledeci nacin:
-svaki unit nosi jedan kill point.
-Svaki heroj nosi jedan kill point.
-Svako vozilo vredi jedan kill point.

Tako da primera radi space marine heroj, sa command squad-om i rhinoom je 3 kill poena.
E sad, ovde ima par bisera i bugova iduci od 1) ako podelis svoj tactical squad u 2 combat squada, to ti je 2 kill poena (sto je ajde kao ok), preko 2)svaki liktor je kill poen jer se nezavisno postavlja, sto takodje znaci i da je svaki IG platoon zaseban kill poen (a bese odbijes 3 za jedan slot) do najbizarnijih 3) biovore mine koje promase i slete na tablu bez detonacije postaju unit, pa vrede kill poen.

Scoring units su troop choises i scoring su do poslednjeg modela. Non-scoring units contestuju objektive do poslednjeg modela takodje. Drugim recima, moras da imas trupu pored objektiva i da protivnik nema NIJEDNU jedinicu pored istog da bi on bio tvoj.

Za stavku 4... ne znam. Zavisice od organizacije turnira. Kako igra sada forsira da ti poeni modela ne znace ama bas nista vec da se sve vrti oko objektiva (tj, ako imas jednog jedinog modela na tabli, koji je troop choise, i drzi objektiv, a protivnik ne drzi ni jedan, ti si dobio i tacka), VP je GW predvideo da se koristi cisto da ne bi bilo previse draw situacija i za racunanje plasmana na tabeli. Drugim recima, najverovatnije ce gorepomentui primer da ti donese win (i da predpostavimo da ti win donosi 3 poena, loose 0 a draw 1, kao u BB-u), ali da po VP-ovima imas minus.... ma sta ga ja znam, ovo su vec nagadjanja koja ce se resiti tek kada budemo videli bodovanje prvog GT-a koji bude organizovan.
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Pa to mi je upravo i bilo nejasno.... moze komotno da se desi da imas 10-20 ucesnika koji na kraju imaju jednako "win-ova".

Kao, to mora nekako da se resi. Ne vidim bolji nacin od starog racunanja.

Mada mozda se desi da umesto tournament poena skupljas te kill poene (za koje ja nista ne znam, jer u knjizi nista ne pise).

Kontam ja da hoce da povecaju troop prodaju, pa su glavno bacili na njih, ali malo je heavy win-draw-loss sistem.

Zna li se kad ta knjiga stize u BG?
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

*Trebalo bi* do kraja meseca da stigne. Pazi, BB liga ima win, draw, loose sistem pa opet je lepo rangirana. Verovatno ce i oni isto to da rade, s time sto ce da racunaju VP za rangiranje onako kako mi racunamo TD razliku u utakmicama... ili slicno. Kao sto rekoh, necemo znati do nekog Grand Tournamenta.

Na stranu to sto hoce prodaju troop choise-ova (heh, hoce prodaju SVEGA u stvari, ali to je logicno, zar ne?), ovaj novi sistem sa objective only bi *trebalo* da oteza listama koje su se fokusirale na odstrelivanje protivnika sa sigurne daljine da budu toliko efikasne. 9 Obliteratora uz jos tonu stvari i dva mala troop choise-a od po 5 marinaca bi u teoriji sada trebalo da en budu toliko neunistivi...
U praksi, samo treba da odstrele sve sa table ponovo :? Mada istina, bice im marginalno teze zbog outflank kretanja, drugacijih deploymenta i sl stvari...
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Pendargon »

bice im marginalno teze
Tako je, napokon su svi naucili... kljucna rec je MARGINALNO. :twisted: :twisted: 8) 8)

Salu na stranu... nije to ni lose u novoj ediciji, taj win0draw-loss, jer zahteva malo vise taktickog pristupa za vecinu (ne sve) armije, pocevsi od pravljenja listi do deploymenta i izbora sta ti je u rezervama. E sad, moj jedini grudge (za sada) je : True LoS
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

True LoS
Glavni problem sa ovim je sto je pravilo podlozno "interpretacijama". Tj. ja kazem da vidim, ti kazes da ne vidim itd itd. Za ovo ce morati da se napravi neki house rule. Mene jedino zanima kako ce to da izgleda na medjunarodnim turnirima. U koje pare da ce svaki sto imati laser-pointer? :lol:
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igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Stick to the topic ppl :)

Evo jedno pocetnicko pitajne od moje strane, vezano bas za TLoS - od kog dela modela gledamo da li vidi? Od glave ili od vrha oruzja? Za vozila su rekli od vrha oruzja, ali za obicne modele ne kazu. Mozda vam zvuci debilno ali... sta ako tvoja puska vidi moj model a glava ne? :)

I o laseru ni reci vise, i on se moze zloupotrebiti. Plus ima boljih alatki od njega (no pun intended :) ).
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Ako je TRUE LoS, onda valjda od ociju?

Moje primedbe na pravila: LoS koji krs, pa onda 10 mesta rupe, zatim ruine koje mogu imati 10 spratova. Ako me usere da dobijem tu stranu table, postavim trupere na 9. sprat (dada, samo da blast weaponi ne bi radili nista), i onda ti se smejem dok se ti 28 krugova penjes do mene a ja pucam. Zatim idu zgrade koje su samo za nijansu manje ubagovane. I zatim idu misije sa win-draw-loss sistemom. Pa onda jedno 100 mesta prazno. Pa onda ona ruap sa nestajanjem woundova (strana 25).

Nisam dugo pratio sta GW izbacuje, ali nisu li oni u skorije vreme izbacili neke kuce, mauzoleje, sta li vec? Po nekim cenama vrlo "razumnim" (ako se ne varam 40-50 funti?)... a znam i da ima ono neko pakovanje valjda ruina ili zgrada? koje je 100 funti?
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Hypodermic »

Ti si svestan da pravila za zgrade ne rade vise isto? ako si na 9om spratu, to znaci da si 27 inca od zemlje. Sta vise, posto moras da budes u 3 inca od objektive-a, ako je objektiv u zgradi, moras da budes na istom spratu gde je i objektiv. Pravila za ruine su ista kao ona iz Cityfight-a (tj Cities of Death). Kako se range meri pod uglom, ti na 9om spratu si efektivno 27 inca i vise udaljen od protivnika.

A pakovanje od 8k dinara ili koliko vec ti donosi 4 velike zgrade (2 ili 3 sprata svaka, gde ground floor vec skriva rhino).

I kad vec moze u bilo kojoj paljbi da mi zagine momak sa PF-om, prihvaticu objasnjenje da su se momci zapucali u dva specificna modela pa je jedna rana "nestala" kako ti kazes ;) makar neka kompenzacija za selektivni odstrel :)
Pendargon wrote:...po toj logici, mogao bih da isecem lepih 10 kockastih komada stiropora, na devet zalepim bolter i bolt pistolj, i granate, i mali nozic, jednom zalepim powerfist da viri, a na jednog zakacim lasscannon, i imam savrsenu jedinicu chaos space marinaca....
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by Dzon Vejn »

Ako si na 9. spratu, i protivnik je na 24 inca od tebe, oruzje od 36" te ima u dometu (Pitagorina teorema).

Ako si na 9. spratu, i protivnik je na 36 inca, oruzje od 48" te ima u dometu (opet Pitagorina teorema).

Realno, 24 inca pokriva JAKO puno terena. 36 da i ne govorim. Koliko ono bese missile launcher / laser cannon domet?

Bilo kako bilo, jasno je da sam sa 9. spratom preterao, ali ako pogledas cinjenice: 2 kruga ti trebaju da stignes do protivnicke zone; u najboljem slucaju (da bacas sve sestice - a tada cu te naterati da pojedes namestene kockice), trebaju ti jos recimo 2 cela kruga samo da stignes do recimo 5. sprata (koji je na bednih 15" (koga ne mrzi nek racuna opet koren iz 15*15+x*x)). Znaci ti tek u 5. krugu mozes da uradis svoj assault 5. sprata. To je pod uslovom da si pojeo svoje kockice :lol:. U realnosti to bi islo daleko teze, jer neki modeli mogu da bace i 1 ili 2. Da ne govorim da mogu par krugova da bace 1 ili 2, te onemoguce one koji su bacili 6 da nastave uzbrdo, zbog toga sto moraju da ocuvaju koherenciju.

Cak i 3. sprat (sa svojih bednih 9" visine) predstavlja ozbiljan problem. A svo to vreme ti pucas iz ruine.

Zgrade su samo za nijansu bolje, jer imas sansu da ih unistis pucanjem, a i kad stignes do njih , power fist sa autohit ce ih unisititi svakako. Mada sa druge strane, modeli u zgradi su NEUNISTIVI... sto je preterano, i jos ako je zgrada AV14, sa novim pravilima, samo laser na 6 pa na 5 i 6 moze da uradi nesto.

edit: disclaimer: da, svestan sam da HS nece promovisati world trade centar, niti bilo ko od normalnih ljudi... samo kazem sta bi moglo da se desi ako naletis na recimo Djozu Groznog :lol:, i da svako pravilo koje otvara rupe, po defaultu nije dobro ;).
That was a hazardous consultation of the Libre Mortis my Lord. An ordeal of high and low doom. The moment I approached the book, it bit me most ferociously.
I must appologize for the explosion that blew off the door of The Chamber Unbreachable, but the simultaneous emergence of seventeen demons from the book spine, caused the spiritual detonation in the soul stoned air of the room.
The whole enterprise was an experience most horrendeous. None but I could have endured it. I was almost damned twice. Even now my soul is twisted to a cork screw.
I suggest you keep the state of your soul to yourself, and inform us, instead, what you have gleamed from the Grimoire.

Hatred and prejudice will never be eradicated. And witch hunts will never be about witches. To have a scapegoat - that's the key. Humans always fear the alien, the odd. Once the mages had left Novigrad, folk turned their anger against the other races... and, as they have for ages, branded their neighbors their greatest foes.

And 'cause I was gazillionaire and I liked doing it so much, I cut that grass for free.

Glory to Arstotzka!
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Re: POCETNICKA PITANJA

Post by PeraNekron »

Uz svo duzno postovanje, i da prostite, ali....ajde nemojte srati obojica.
Mind Uploader wrote:... Kazem ja da je Pera isti Darth Vader, samo bez te moralne dubine...
Hypodermic wrote:Da nije robotech-a ne bih bio ovakakv kakav jesam!
Giga wrote:Realno, sasvim je logicno da mogu bez problema da ih bace sa par stotina metara i da budu prilicno sigurni da tom land raideru nece biti nista
igor wrote:jako je tesko uzimati puno poena jer se igra po knjizi.
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